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Off The Peg Fiction
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sulcus
 04 Mar 2011, 21:16 #112434 Reply To Post
Sammy very helpfully alerted members to a call for submissions by Angry Robot Books and I have no wish to dissuade members from doing so, or even particularly to pick on this particular imprint. But I went over to look at their website and what they say absolutely encapsulates what I believe to be the present shortcomings of publishing and why maybe mainstream books aren't faring terribly well. Again, I don't wish to pick on this particular company, but see it as representative of much of the industry as a whole.

I quote: this is what they are seeking in a MS submission

hard SF, space opera, cyberpunk, military SF, alternate future history, future crime, time travel, and more. We have no problem if your book mashes together two or more of these genres; in fact, we practically insist upon it.

Writers should write what they want to write. Then they should approach the question of trying to place it with a publishers, assuming they're not going to publish it themselves. Writers used just to write fiction; yes it may have been SciFi, YA, horror or fantasy (and recently the dreary marketeer's label chicklit). Here however, the request is far more specific, far more sub-divided from mere fantasy or SciFi. We have 'hard' SciFi or Space Opera, or specifically time travel. Or crime carried out in future worlds. So a book like Stanilaus Lem's "Solaris", one of the best SciFi books ever written, probably wouldn't have fitted their rubric. Same for "Quarantine" by Greg Egan.

Then if that wasn't definitive and reductive enough, they virtually demand that two of these sub-genres be spliced together in the current buzz-term 'mash-up'. Perish the thought that's because one on its own is insufficient to sustain a long-term audience. I'm sorry, but these labels treat readers as idiots. That somehow they are only interested in one or two narrowly defined realms of literature, with little possiblity of a reader liking SciFi and say Horror, or Fantasy (urban or otherwise) and literary fiction. The more the marketeers try and pinpoint target markets by excluding potential readers, the more they risk cutting their own throats. Yes a small publishing house may be able to corner the niche market in say cyberpunk, but it is a high risk strategy. Is cyber-punk as popular as in its heyday of the 1990's?

The danger is unsigned authors look at these specific qualifications and either decide their book fits one of the categories even when it doesn't really and tailors their submission letter to try and pull the wool over the publishers' eyes, or worse, they actually re-edit their work to try and wedge it into the catergorisation.

The work must stay true to the vision of the writer and then figure out where to place it. If we start trying to fit in with the external demands of the publishers, if they set the agenda not just at the market level (what books they will and won't take on as they have always done), but also so as to influence the writing process, then we and fiction itself is doomed.
This post was last edited by sulcus, 04 Mar 2011, 21:21
"A,B&E", "Not In My Name" and "52FF" (flash fiction anthology) all available on Amazon Kindle

"How a psychopath makes sweet love. I can get you ringside. Royal box even."
Sammy
 04 Mar 2011, 21:34 #112437 Reply To Post
Sammy did not alert people to this . . . michellebeaching did. Sammy just thanked Michelle for bringing it to her attention. Sammy is someone who happens to write in this 'genre' because it is what she loves and does best.

I thank you.

x
'Stay away from your potential. It's like your bank balance. There's never as much of it as you think.'
sulcus
 04 Mar 2011, 21:38 #112439 Reply To Post
Quote: Sammy, Friday, 4 Mar 2011 21:34
Sammy did not alert people to this . . . michellebeaching did. Sammy just thanked Michelle for bringing it to her attention. Sammy is someone who happens to write in this 'genre' because it is what she loves and does best.

I thank you.

x


Apologies.

Now as someone who writes in the genre, what do you feel about this ever-refined filtering process of your genre?
"A,B&E", "Not In My Name" and "52FF" (flash fiction anthology) all available on Amazon Kindle

"How a psychopath makes sweet love. I can get you ringside. Royal box even."
Sammy
 04 Mar 2011, 21:43 #112443 Reply To Post
Oh, and can I just add . . .

FOR F**K'S SAKE, SULCUS!!!! CHANGE THE F**CKING RECORD.

Some Killers or Pearl Jam perhaps? No, wait, you would probably prefer some experimental, unlistenable dirge from a band that challenges people perceptions of music and no-one else has heard of . . . until it becomes popular whereupon it's instantly rendered crap.

THUD, THUD, THUD, OW, THUD, THUD, THUD, OW.

(sound of Sammy hitting head against desk until, hopefully, unconsciousness)

Aaaargh!
'Stay away from your potential. It's like your bank balance. There's never as much of it as you think.'
Sammy
 04 Mar 2011, 21:48 #112445 Reply To Post
Quote: sulcus, Friday, 4 Mar 2011 21:38
Quote: Sammy, Friday, 4 Mar 2011 21:34
Sammy did not alert people to this . . . michellebeaching did. Sammy just thanked Michelle for bringing it to her attention. Sammy is someone who happens to write in this 'genre' because it is what she loves and does best.

I thank you.

x


Apologies.

Now as someone who writes in the genre, what do you feel about this ever-refined filtering process of your genre?



Okay. My turn to aplogise. I ranted. Sorry, Sulcus.

There's a reason I haven't been on site for a month and it's left me a tad . . . well, un-mellowed is probably the best way to describe it.

Anyway, I don't really care about the 'ever-refined filtering' is the answer. There are so few agents and publishers who will acept 'horror' submissions these days that anyone willing to take a look is worth a punt.

Sorry again by the way.

Ow . . . and now I also have a sore head, although maybe that's the wine.

x
'Stay away from your potential. It's like your bank balance. There's never as much of it as you think.'
Sammy
 04 Mar 2011, 21:52 #112447 Reply To Post
Sorry. Again.

'Stay away from your potential. It's like your bank balance. There's never as much of it as you think.'
sulcus
 04 Mar 2011, 22:00 #112448 Reply To Post
Quote: Sammy, Friday, 4 Mar 2011 21:52
Sorry. Again.



No problem. But I will keep beating this drum until we know what new models the publishing industry settled down to, cos these current ones just ain't working.
"A,B&E", "Not In My Name" and "52FF" (flash fiction anthology) all available on Amazon Kindle

"How a psychopath makes sweet love. I can get you ringside. Royal box even."
Sammy
 04 Mar 2011, 22:17 #112449 Reply To Post
Quote: sulcus, Friday, 4 Mar 2011 22:00
Quote: Sammy, Friday, 4 Mar 2011 21:52
Sorry. Again.



No problem. But I will keep beating this drum until we know what new models the publishing industry settled down to, cos these current ones just ain't working.


The publishing industry isn't working. Full-stop. This filters down to agents who are now taking on fewer new authors than ever. Agents who gave me feedback two years ago aren't even accepting submissions now.

Only one, Darley Anderson, have continued to express interest and offer constructive criticism (although they haven't of course, signed me up). BUT they are a rare and shining light in the industry.

One of the problems is the completely outdated 'advance' system which is the agent's bread and butter. It's ridiculous because, usually, the publisher never gets the advance back. Although, they still seem happy to hand them out to ex-soap actresses and thick Geordie singers.

I'm increasingly despairing of the 'traditional' publishing industry. You don't have to be a non-conformist literary writer to find yourself banging your head against a brick wall.

Anyone who indulges in cross-genre writing, or who isn't conforming to a formula, or, let's face it, is a new writer, however good, is facing a near impossible uphill struggle now. In the current climate publishers won't take chances.

That's why I'm starting to believe the best way IS to go it alone.

x
This post was last edited by Sammy, 04 Mar 2011, 22:33
'Stay away from your potential. It's like your bank balance. There's never as much of it as you think.'
sulcus
 04 Mar 2011, 22:32 #112451 Reply To Post
Quote: Sammy, Friday, 4 Mar 2011 22:17
Quote: sulcus, Friday, 4 Mar 2011 22:00
Quote: Sammy, Friday, 4 Mar 2011 21:52
Sorry. Again.



No problem. But I will keep beating this drum until we know what new models the publishing industry settled down to, cos these current ones just ain't working.


The publishing industry isn't working. Full-stop. This filters down to agents who are now taking on fewer new authors than ever. Agents who gave me feedback two years ago aren't even accepting submissions now.

One of the problems is the increasingly outdated 'advance' system which is the agent's bread and butter. It's ridiculous because, usually, the publisher never gets the advance back. Although, they still seem happy to hand them out to ex-soap actresses and thick Geordie singers.

I'm increaisngly despairing of the 'traditional' publishing industry. You don't have to be a non-conformist literary writer to find yourself banging your head against a brick wall.

Anyone who indulges in cross-genre writing, or who isn't conforming to a formula, or, let's face it, is a new writer, however good, is facing a near impossible uphill struggle now. In the current climate publishers won't take chances.

That's why I'm starting to believe the best way IS to go it alone.

x


can't disagree with a single word of that
"A,B&E", "Not In My Name" and "52FF" (flash fiction anthology) all available on Amazon Kindle

"How a psychopath makes sweet love. I can get you ringside. Royal box even."
Palache
 04 Mar 2011, 23:17 #112460 Reply To Post
Although I understand hardly a thing in this thread, this is YWO AT ITS BEST.
This post was last edited by Palache, 04 Mar 2011, 23:19
my website
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